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Post by Glenn on Jan 8, 2019 20:49:05 GMT -6
Saw this Registered heifer on FB tonight.   |
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Thoughts?
Jan 8, 2019 21:26:47 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by fivestarherefords on Jan 8, 2019 21:26:47 GMT -6
3008 about 3 generations back?
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Post by Glenn on Jan 9, 2019 7:39:51 GMT -6
Didn't look at the pedigree. I believe it is posted however. I'll look.
I will say that I have noticed something in salebooks that I have received the last 2-3 years from multiple different breeders, and that is you are almost guaranteed two goggle eyes if you put 3008 in the top and bottom half of a three generation pedigree.
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Post by strojanherefords on Jan 9, 2019 12:58:04 GMT -6
I know how frustrating the lack of leadership is on the purity issue. But it isn't fair to pick on breeders that used those genetics after the associations dismissed the reports from Australia. What is sad is how ubiquitous those suspect genetics have become. So much of our genetic base has been lost to the proliferation of those genetics.
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Post by larso on Jan 9, 2019 14:24:06 GMT -6
I know how frustrating the lack of leadership is on the purity issue. But it isn't fair to pick on breeders that used those genetics after the associations dismissed the reports from Australia. What is sad is how ubiquitous those suspect genetics have become. So much of our genetic base has been lost to the proliferation of those genetics. The trouble is, is what was once unacceptable has become acceptable either through apathy, lack of knowledge or corruption. I think what will become evident soon is the deviation from HOP genetics is far wider and extensive than anyone 1st thought. |
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Post by George on Jan 10, 2019 9:52:14 GMT -6
My thoughts:  Farewell. |
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Post by tartancowgirl on Jan 10, 2019 12:12:15 GMT -6
Can't really "like" that picture!
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Post by oldduffer on Jan 10, 2019 15:36:51 GMT -6
Saw this Registered heifer on FB tonight. |
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Post by oldduffer on Jan 10, 2019 15:38:38 GMT -6
So why do we continue to put up with this???
Aren't there enough people out there who would like to make Herefords GREAT again??
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Post by Glenn on Jan 10, 2019 16:24:56 GMT -6
So why do we continue to put up with this??? Aren't there enough people out there who would like to make Herefords GREAT again?? I just don’t know anymore. I may be off base but my gut tells me the majority of breeders actually thinks this animal represents where the breed needs to be. |
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Post by oldduffer on Jan 11, 2019 11:38:36 GMT -6
Time to clean house OR consider starting a HEREFORD registry.
Let's make Herefords GREAT again!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by jayh on Jan 11, 2019 18:36:35 GMT -6
So why do we continue to put up with this??? Aren't there enough people out there who would like to make Herefords GREAT again?? I just don’t know anymore. I may be off base but my gut tells me the majority of breeders actually thinks this animal represents where the breed needs to be. Glenn I hate to say this but I agree with u. That is what they expect a HEREFORD to be. (Crossbred) . |
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Post by strojanherefords on Jan 11, 2019 21:00:42 GMT -6
George, you do realize Iron Eyes Cody was not an Indian. |
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Post by mrvictordomino on Jan 12, 2019 9:41:44 GMT -6
Saw this Registered heifer on FB tonight. Didn't see the original FB post so don't know who posted or what the pedigree says but any good commercial cattlemen with any experience at all would think that this would be a Hereford cross. Looking at sale catalogs this past year seems more and more "Herefords" are showing traits I am not familiar with over the past forty years. |
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Post by oldduffer on Jan 12, 2019 10:35:50 GMT -6
So I repeat the question: "WHY DO WE AS REAL HEREFORD BREEDERS CONTINUE TO PUT UP WITH THIS?"
Let's Make Herefords GREAT again!!!!!
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Post by mrvictordomino on Jan 12, 2019 13:03:18 GMT -6
So I repeat the question: "WHY DO WE AS REAL HEREFORD BREEDERS CONTINUE TO PUT UP WITH THIS?" Let's Make Herefords GREAT again!!!!! For me it’s simple, I will never use any contemporary genetics in my program... Not my program. Doesn’t address the issue though. |
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Post by guffeygal on Jan 13, 2019 7:22:42 GMT -6
Definitely not a simple issue for the breed. Just like the Titan issue We think you have four types of breeders. Those who have an agenda, those who don"t realize the issue, those who feel if the Association accepts a pedigree it is fine to use the genetics, and those who do their utmost to stay away from these genetics. We think one of the strongest arguments the latter category can make is the dilution of hy-brid vigor kick for the commercial producer. We were surprised to see in one sale catalog last spring a breeder bragging about a 15 POUND advantage in a clients weaning weights when using said breeders Hereford bulls on his Red Angus cows as compared to producer's straight bred Red Angus calves. Industry figures we have always referenced are in the 50-60 pound range for weaning weight and we have had clients report greater advantages on straight Angus cows.
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Post by timbernt on Jan 13, 2019 7:46:53 GMT -6
I think the Dewalls are correct in their thoughts. To many new Hereford people the name is only a color pattern. The big name breeders like Rausch, Churchill, KCF, Shaw, and a whole host more who pander to the unaware and uncaring are the real problem. Breed identity is rapidly disappearing. Anyone with the guts to point it out is automatically branded a nut and not in touch with reality. The reality is these blaze faced cattle are not Herefords. I have been using Fleck/Hereford cross cattle for 35 years. Anyone who has been here can tell you it takes a whole lot more than 50% Fleck to get the color pattern in this photo.
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Post by larso on Jan 13, 2019 14:32:56 GMT -6
I think the Dewalls are correct in their thoughts. To many new Hereford people the name is only a color pattern. The big name breeders like Rausch, Churchill, KCF, Shaw, and a whole host more who pander to the unaware and uncaring are the real problem. Breed identity is rapidly disappearing. Anyone with the guts to point it out is automatically branded a nut and not in touch with reality. The reality is these blaze faced cattle are not Herefords. I have been using Fleck/Hereford cross cattle for 35 years. Anyone who has been here can tell you it takes a whole lot more than 50% Fleck to get the color pattern in this photo. [ Totally agree with your last sentence Tim and the repercussions of that means that the % of accuracy on the 2nd line of evb’s is not worth the paper it’s written on. |
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Post by timbernt on Jan 13, 2019 17:30:14 GMT -6
I have had many people admire my Fleck/Hereford cross cattle and ask me why I don't keep and sell bulls from them. I have in the past, but even though some of those cattle approach the percentage required to be registered as purebred, my experience in the past is they are too inconsistent. With the constant intermingling of breeds seen in today's leading Hereford herds there can be no dependability for real cowman. There are a number of linebreeding programs left in the Hereford breed. While I think most of them lack the performance I want, I admire those people as being the future of the breed if there is a future for us.
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Post by randy on Jan 16, 2019 20:32:30 GMT -6
Hmmm.... Smoke this up in your pipe... " You can learn more about a breeders programat the local sale barn than you can at his bull sale"....
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Post by timbernt on Jan 16, 2019 20:47:05 GMT -6
Absolutely correct in my opinion. Commercial cowman are looking for bulls that will give them payweight, conformation, and maternal doability. What Hereford breeders are giving them is a bunch of made up EPD's. Instead of bitching about the "Hereford discount" go ask your market owner or order buyer what is wrong with your cattle. We think we can force buyers to like these red poll or longhorn crosses and it ain't working!
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Jan 24, 2019 13:03:57 GMT -6
Hmmm.... Smoke this up in your pipe... " You can learn more about a breeders programat the local sale barn than you can at his bull sale".... Took 5 calves I'd sorted to the local sale barn last week, got there early so not too busy yet, (true story) owner of the barn came up to me and said "nice set of calves, what's the story on them" I said thanks and we chatted a little while they got them weighed. I still got docked.  |
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